Ep 177 w/ Jacob Lemanski – Cycling the World: A 999-Day Adventure Across 38,000 Miles

What about rest days? Did you have any rules on that?

If I rested, I didn't have anything to do. So I would try and bike every day. Sometimes I was in a city. I wanted to spend a day in the city that would happen every six months or something. Maybe I would take days off in a city. really I was biking pretty much. Shoot for like 80 kilometers.

every day.

You

know, certainly the endorphins were always flooding me and I felt, you know, just so happy being in this state of constant exercise. The fittest I was, was in the Andes. Maybe I'd been out for about 600 days. It took that long. I have a clear memory of just sitting and having lunch on the edge of a farm field and just having this, it's like hang, run through my body, the idea, I think I'm done. And I just ignored it. You I'd been out a long time and

I didn't want to believe it. But you know, wasn't going away. A few days later, I felt it again. And it wasn't long after that before if I could have teleported home, I would have. I was at my wits end.

Do you love spontaneous adventures, travel tips and stories that will inspire you to pack up and go? Well, welcome to the Winging It Travel Podcast. I'm James, your host, and each week I bring you travel tales, practical advice and interviews with travelers from around the globe. Whether you're planning a big trip or just dreaming about one, you'll find everything from hidden gems to epic fails because travel is not perfect and that is what makes it beautiful. So grab your backpack and let's wing it.

New episodes every Monday, wherever you get your podcasts and on YouTube too. You can find Winging It, a more fantastic travel podcast from around the world at voyerskate.com. The link is in the show notes. Let's go and explore the world. Hello and welcome to this week's episode where I'm joined by Jacob Lemansky, who went on a journey to bike the world as far as he could before he had to quit. So 999 days and 38,000 miles later, the journey was complete.

Jacob has cycled around the world twice and he's on here, the podcast today, to talk about each day of his journey. Well, not each day, but a summary of the journey. How has podcasts, how to move to stars has begun and anything else about the travels, logistics of the trip and much more. Welcome to the show. How are you doing? Great. are me? Please tell listeners where you're based right now. I'm in... Nice. And for people who may be in Europe, where is that in the USA?

Thanks for having

in Denver, Colorado.

Colorado is right in the center of the country. It's where the mountains start. The western half of the state is steep and mountainous and the eastern half of the state is as flat as a pancake.

And how would you describe Colorado as a state?

Colorado, it's very outdoorsy. It's friendly, a little slower pace than the East Coast.

Yeah. And what is it probably known for apart from the Rockies maybe?

Well, we are one of the first states to legalize cannabis. Okay. We're well known for that.

Fair enough. I've been in Vancouver. That's big thing. I can tell you that.

it is popular.

Can you the listeners and the viewers where did you grow up and was there any trouble in trust early doors?

I grew

up on the East coast in Pennsylvania, just lived in a small town in rural. And, you know, we went on family vacations, but the first time I was out of the country was when I started my bike journey. Traveling wasn't a big thing for me. And even on this bike journey, my goal was really to ride my bike and sleep in beautiful places. Traveling just came out of that.

Yeah. I mean, that's a pretty bold move to go from growing up in USA, doing local travel and then straight into your biking journey abroad. That's quite a bold move, isn't it?

It was, but, you know, you got to jump in and honestly, if I knew what I was getting myself into better than I did, maybe I wouldn't have started.

okay. That's a precursor to the chat coming in. Fair enough. Okay. And was there any trip early doors that you do remember maybe locally that maybe sparked some interest? Like was there one particular experience or trip?

Though

So biking was always there as an interest.

After that trip, was, I bought a bicycle just to do that ride. And then I came home in good shape and I never stopped pedaling.

You know what, since COVID lockdown, if you have an office job, you know, even walking, I don't know, 6,000 steps is not really a routine anymore unless you make yourself go, right? Because when you work day to day and you're probably like going into town or whatever you do, you generally get casually quite a few thousand steps. But I just realized that unless I really get out there and force myself to get out for a walk, you just don't do anything like that. Quite strange really.

on the same way I work from home and if I don't have anywhere to go, I don't go anywhere.

I'm just saying, I feel quite bad sometimes, especially if it's good weather. Okay. And I want to go a few more questions before we get into the trip. How did you integrate travels going into college and adulthood? Because I guess you're still doing trips, maybe alongside studies or work. So how did you view it? Because I know USA is not known for its vacation time if you're working. So how did you fit around that?

during university, would have summers off and so usually I would work, but two summers I managed to just give myself the time to not get a job at all. So I was able to do that then when I was young and then, yeah, typically all my jobs, had 10 days of vacation a year and it was never enough for a long bike ride. So, I would, I just had to quit my job.

Yeah, I hear that quite a lot because what choice do you have? 10 days is not a lot there, is it? mean, is that getting better or is it still going to stay the same, do you think?

As far as I know, stays the same. Yeah. If you stay at a company for eight years, you'll get 15 days. If you're there for 15 years, they'll, they'll bump you all the way up to 20 days of vacation. That's partly why I had to quit to go ride my bike.

Yeah, that's fair enough. And I mentioned biking before. Was there any other sporty activities that you liked? You mentioned hiking the Appalachian there as well. So were you just always outdoorsy?

I grew up playing team sports, and I was pretty good athlete. And when I got to college, stopped team sports, but really that first bike ride across the country just got me in, in good shape. so exercise just became a hobby for me after that.

Just quickly on team sports, which sports did you play? Because I know for my UK listeners, probably football is the main one, soccer if you want to call it that. But USA you have a lot of choice, so where were you?

Yeah, I played a U S football. I played baseball. played lacrosse. I wrestled for a couple of years. I did all the sports, you know, it was really, what my parents did to get me out of their hair as I was growing up.

Fair enough. Okay. So let's go into the biking trip, an epic trip as I mentioned in the intro. First of all, I'm to kick off with what year was the journey?

2013

Well, the idea came to me, I think I was, I must've been 27 years old and for years I had just been trying to see how strong I could be. And it became very important to me to know, to know exactly that I was only going to be young, a young man once in my life. What can I do with, with this body I have? And I thought I'll, I'll try and bike around the world. It'll be so hard that I quit out there. My goal was really to.

go until I stopped. I had this idea only in getting to a place where I could go no further would I know that I went as far as I could. I didn't want to arrive and be successful. I could have went one more step after that. I actually wanted to quit. And so that was kind of the inspiration of, I'll bike around the world. It'll be so hard that I'll quit out there somewhere. I actually thought maybe in about six months I'd be done for years.

Yeah, okay. So two questions. The quitting thing is based purely on like physical. You just can't do it anymore or is it still mentally part of that as well? Like you just had enough like in terms of I'd still want to bike anymore. is it physical and mental or both do you think?

I didn't know when I started. Honestly, I thought I'll get tired. I'll get so tired I stopped. But you know, you go to sleep and you wake up and you're just stronger than yesterday. eventually it became a mental thing, but you know, I could have got injured out there. Maybe I meet someone and want to stop and stay with them. Maybe I find a place so beautiful that I decided this is my home now. I didn't know that was part of the adventure.

Yeah

That's awesome, yeah. So cool and brave to do. I'm going to ask a question which is kind of jumping ahead a little bit, but knowing what you know now, do you think your kind of trip is doable for a certain age range? So you said 27 you went. Do you think there's a cutoff point where, I don't know how old you are now, well, I guess I could do the math, but do you think...

like mid thirties is probably not doable to do that trip or do you think it's just mental thing you gotta get fit and you just go and do it or do think it's a cut off point physically?

depends on how far people want to go. I met a guy that was 81 bicycling across the United States. He said it was his fourth time. It'll be his last time. I met a man in his seventies biking from Cusco in Peru, north to Cartagena, like right through the thick of the mountains. you know, it's, it's a, whatever people are up for, they can do it. And especially to

Okay.

to go until you want to quit. That's a, it's a very personal thing. Maybe it's two weeks and that's as far as you got, but you know, that's, that's something for anyone to figure out for themselves.

Yeah, I've got question that later on actually about how long it takes for you to get used to it. But I'll bring that on later, but between thinking about it and maybe decided mentally you want to do it to actually going, how long was the period of time of organization? Because I assume you've got to probably get some finance together. You've got to your bike together, you're packing gear together. Even just like planning the route for the first couple of weeks. How long did that organization take?

It took a year before I left, and I was waiting for the weather and had to start at the right time of year. but also just, it took a year to actually build up the courage to quit my job and go try and do this thing.

Yeah, I wasn't going to ask that, guess quitting your job is a big thing. So did you keep it a secret? Did you tell people early doors? Did you bring it on slowly? How did that journey go from quitting your job?

I think I just gave him my two week notice. I told him what I was up to. I was designing air conditioners for helicopters. I have an engineering background. you know, they would find a replacement and they all wish me luck. They all said they wouldn't do it, but they wished I could. they were, you know, they were all encouraging.

Okay, and that kind of brings me on nicely to the budget. What are you thinking?

You know, I had money saved and, um, I'll just tell you the whole trip, a thousand days cost $24,000. Um, so, you know, lot of that was like my gear flight. When I was actually on the road, I would just eat a couple of dollars of food a day and then sleep outside. I was basically homeless, but, I had, when I started, I had funds close to 50,000. So when I was out there,

I couldn't even see the end of my money. just seemed like I could exist out there forever.

obviously have quite a nice little backdrop in terms of your money because I know I guess a lot of people would try and test that right with any having I guess a certain amount and that's it. There's no more backup.

If I had to think about, mean, I just go until I quit. Maybe I run out of money that could have been an option as well. But I did try to live as cheaply as I possibly could and hope my money lasted till the end. was really the only math I was doing.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Okay. And was there any contingency plans, maybe earn money if you think you did run out, but you want to carry on?

I would not have wanted to work while I was trying to do that trip. that's just, you know, that's it for that for me. A lot of people, a lot of people do that though. you know, they get odd jobs along the way and extend their travels, but usually they start without much money either.

Yeah, guess the problem with that in your type of trip is you're then working instead of biking, aren't you? so guess it's kind of like the beginning and the end, think at that point.

Exactly. You know, and I met people that had been out there for years and they would take months off every year to pick fruit or whatever, you

Okay. And I know this might seem quite broad question, but the route, I know you just plan to go until you stop, but did you have a rough idea in mind? Yeah. Like time scales. Did you know the first two weeks, the first month, maybe the first six months, any idea in your mind?

No, I didn't, I didn't really plan anything. I investigated like getting maps ahead of time, but I was crossing countries so fast. would need literally a big stack of maps carrying with me. It didn't hardly make sense. And I didn't know how long I was going to be out there. So to plan very far ahead, didn't make much sense. Really. I would just figure out where the next grocery store would be. And I'd make sure I'd had enough food to get there. And then I'd figure out the grocery store after that. And so really I was only planning.

maybe three days ahead. The only, the one thing that did check prior to leaving was where I needed visas. And that would have been Russia. had to get a visa ahead of time in China. Otherwise the whole rest of the world, could just show up at the border and they would let me in as an American.

I had a

tablet and when I got to wifi, I could send emails and stuff. and that, and that was my map as well. but really what I was doing, I was just pointing the direction, you know, the trip started in Portugal and I was going east. So I would just kind of headed that way. And part of not planning, I really wanted to feel like an explorer out there. I wanted to arrive with fresh eyes everywhere I went.

And so not knowing what was ahead wasn't important to me. Like I wanted the mystery and it probably meant I missed some really interesting things that were nearby and I just didn't look that way. But, I also got the feel like I was an explorer.

Yeah, don't think you want to plan too much. And if you miss something, you can always go back. I mean, it's not like a big deal, but yeah, it's pretty cool. I think it's pretty admirable to go, do you know what? I'm just going to go east and whatever the wind takes me, that's fine. Not too much research and just going to flow. That's pretty cool. think that's a way to do it.

It was fun. Yeah. actually I would point. So another leg was from Alaska to the Southern tip of South America. I was pointing South for so long that there's this one evening where the road had turned North and I didn't realize it. And it was like, I would just, something was up, right? It's late. It's around five and I just couldn't figure it out. And then I realized the sun was setting on my left side and sit on my right side. I had just been pointing South for so long that.

the sun was felt like it was in the wrong part of the sky.

Do think it's like down to tiredness or just not concentrating?

You know, it was just like, I had just been, I had just been looking one direction for six months in a row. and honestly living outside, end up the sun becomes a character in your life. So does the moon and the stars, like I'm out there with them all the time. I'm paying attention. I can't not pay attention. So for the sun just to be in it on my left instead of my right, just totally threw me.

I get it. Okay. And the equipment. let's talk about this because I guess you've got to figure out your weight on your bike. So I guess some people want to know what type of bike did you have and how much equipment did you pack onto the bike? what was your rules on that?

I wrote a Surly long haul trucker. It's just a steel frame touring bike. A lot of people were out there on those bikes are made for it. Um, I upgraded all the components. wanted the top of the line stuff. I wanted to be like a ship at sea. My goal is to leave and never have to buy anything except food and water. And you know, so I packed clothing for all temperatures, but also I would end up wearing my clothes until they were ragged. Cause I,

Wasn't that myself buy new stuff. Eventually people would just start to give me clothing because I had so many holes in my shirt. and the, the weight of it all, like I wanted to have everything I needed, but not one thing more. Right. So it's where's, where's, where do you draw the line? And my bike ended up weighing about, about 60 kilograms. and then it was food and water in, the

like the hottest deserts, the longest stretches I'd leave town with another maybe 22 liters of water, another 22 kilograms. So the bike would get heavy at times. Yeah.

Hmm,

yeah the water's a kidder isn't it? Nothing to do about it.

I just accepted it at some point. But yeah, leaving town with an extra 20 kilograms of water, I would feel it for sure.

Yeah, I guess like the early days of leaving towns. Yeah, I guess it gets easier as you get to the... I don't know.

But the next year...

Yeah, yeah, of course. Yeah. It must be like this continuous cycle of, oh, it's heavy and then gets light and then back on heavy and yeah, that's quite interesting.

Yeah,

you just have the food bag and you fill it up and then you eat it all and you fill it up and eat it all. That was kind of the whole thing. Yeah.

Okay, before we get into more details of that, just quickly describe the route or the journey for your nearly thousand days.

trip.

So I started in Lisbon, Portugal, crossed Europe over, followed the Mediterranean coast, through Eastern Europe into Ukraine, into Southern Russia, crossed Southern Russia into Mongolia. I spent a month in crossing Mongolia and then two months going south down through China, almost to Vietnam. From there, I went up to Alaska, up to the Arctic Circle, and then I bicycled south all the way to the southern tip of South America.

Then I crossed New Zealand and Australia, and then I did a hundred days north across Africa.

So you've got to work with the weather here as well, right? You must have that in mind.

I started up in Alaska very early spring up there and I was planning on getting down to the southern tip of Argentina before winter came. But I didn't go fast enough. ended up arriving in the south right in the dead of winter. So it was cold and the cold I could handle but the nights are like 16 hours long. You know, was like way down there in the winter.

That was just something else I had to deal with.

If you're in Alaska and it's like early spring, that's going to be cold, right? So what are you doing for sleeping in terms of accommodation? Were you always outside or were there periods of time where you did actually stay in guest houses or hostels or hotels?

I always preferred sleeping outside. I'd end up inside maybe once or twice a month. Um, if I get to a town in the evening and decide to stay, but I slept in a hammock and I had, I had a backup tent, but really I preferred the hammock and it had bug mash and had a rain fly. So it was just fine for camping. um, I felt most comfortable just sneaking off into the forest or into the farm field. And if no one in the whole world knew where I was and I felt safe,

So that's, that's how I would do it. I'd go, I'd go sleep in the wild.

So Alaska, because I'm thinking where I'm now in Vancouver, what I would be probably wary about is bears, especially when it approaches the spring and summer. So any encounters with those?

You know, the bears were just coming out of hibernation when I was out there and they're all really, they're all sleepy and they're all eating dandelions because apparently that helps with their digestion after hibernation. So I saw maybe 30 bears. were just all eating the eating grass along the side of the road. so bears, you know, bears, I was nervous. Certainly the first couple I saw, but by the time I saw 30 of them, I just like a little faster to get, get by them.

I'm just like in the spring they'd be like ravenous because they'd be hungry right after waking up. But hey, if it's eating down the lines, that's fine.

Yeah,

they needed to lax it in first before they started going after bigger meals, I guess.

That's very interesting. Okay. And this is where I come to the fitness part. how was the first few weeks? Did it take a while to get used to biking every day? Did you have any rules of biking every day? Like rest days or yeah, how did you get stronger? Like how long was that process do you think? Cause I guess the initial week or two must be tough cause you are getting used to it and that could be quite easy to quit, couldn't it?

You know, I had a pretty good foundation. Like I ran a lot and I was up for it, but I would say I got in better shape for years. For years I was getting in better shape out there. And it changes with the terrain. Like across Russia was perfectly flat for two months. And then when I hit the mountains, I was in the Andes for two months. That's steep climbing every day.

So even, even throughout the trip, my fitness would change between different, different regions. Yeah. but as far as starting,

Yeah, my legs felt, they felt like deeply fatigued for years. What I can say about it. I would, in the mountains, I would just get so much lactic acid built up over weeks of pedaling that it would be literal flames in my thighs. It would be so painful that I could only do one pedal stroke at a time when I'd start in the morning and then.

I'd get two in and I'd have to stop again and eventually I'd loosen up and start my day, you know? um, can I say it it was always kind of hard. Yeah.

Yeah. Any like close points to quitting? Well... Before you quit.

You know, it took a long time to get to the point of quitting. it was kind of a, a slow, a slow descent, but for the most part, I, was just joyous to be out there. Yeah.

Yeah. In amongst nature and stuff. That's amazing. And how long did it take you, do you think, to where you got to really feel that it's easy? Because I know you're quite fit anyway in building up to that, but the body must get into a nice routine after a while where it's not actually a chore. It's a, like I say, after one or two pedals, like was there a period of time we thought, do you know what? I'm at the top of my fitness here.

You know, that certainly the endorphins are always flooded me and I felt, you know, just so happy being in this state of constant, constant exercise. The fittest I was, was in the Andes. Maybe I had been out for about 600 days. It took that long. and yeah, I mean, it's, it's, it's wonderful to feel that strong to be able to peddle.

a heavy bike like that up a mountain all day long and just have the strength to do it. was a really, really beautiful to feel that way.

What about rest days? Did you have any rules on that?

Um,

if I rested, I didn't have anything to do, so I would try and bike every day. you know, sometimes I was in a city. wanted to spend a day in the city. Um, you know, that, that would, that would happen every six months or something. Maybe a few days off in a city. So, um, really I was, I was biking pretty much every day.

okay.

What was the average do you think every day? I know you probably do the math on that, but average kilometers a day?

Yeah,

I would shoot for like 80 kilometers. I had a bike computer and if it was less than that, I'd feel a little bad. And if it's more than that, I'd feel happy. And eventually I got rid of that bike computer and then I could feel happy no matter how far I went. And then I, you know, when I stopped paying attention to it, could just pay attention directly just to my body and just not, not feel good or bad about how far I went in the day. Cause really didn't matter.

Yeah. Okay. Fair enough. And when you stayed in hostels or hotels once a month, was that like a luxury sort of, I don't know what you call it, like treat? Cause you've done like a month's worth or was that just our necessity?

It would always have been out of necessity, yeah, mean, knowing you're going to sleep at night, having a nice, a four walls around me, having the internet, you know, they were, I'd say anytime after the first, three months, for the whole rest of the trip, whenever I stopped, it was hard to leave. Cause I mean, it's comfortable place. It was, it was always hard to.

start back into that big hard journey. But then I'd start and I would, within a mile, I'd be like, this is actually what I love doing. I didn't want to sit in that hotel looking at the internet. I wanted to be out here on my bicycle, but you understand it's so tempting just to sit in a hotel and be on the internet.

But you must have appreciated those things even more because you weren't doing it every day, like staying at hotel. So when you got there, must have been quite a nice feeling.

Absolutely. I mean, I would go weeks even as long as a month without having conversations with people that spoke. So just to have some arrive somewhere and have someone to talk to as a treat.

yeah.

Okay.

And how important was like the travel aspects in your trip, um, as opposed to the scene nature, like, did you want to see anything like, was anything on your list for your journey? Like, I dunno, it could be an example of, I dunno, you're going to Italy and you want to see Rome. I don't know. But was there anything travel based, like you want to do some tours or see a thing in particular, or was that just whatever comes up next? I might do that.

It was always just whatever came up. Cause I didn't, I didn't know how I could have quit tomorrow at any time. So I, I didn't know what was ahead for me to see and I wasn't researching it. And you know, like I wanted to see, I wanted to see a field of wheat in the wind moving like waves. I had, I had like concepts, natural things I was looking for. I said, hung my hammock every night. So I was always looking for new and different types of trees, different species of trees to hang my hammock in. So.

I had things that I was looking for, it wasn't, it was nothing manmade.

What was the best thing you saw nature wise then do think?

I

always just love being in the mountains. So the bigger the better and to. know, crossing a mountain range always. I always feel so powerful. Head into the foothills and be in there for a week and then roll down the other side and to carry myself over mountain range. That was always a profound experience. But I saw, you know, one of those long nights down in Argentina.

I woke up, I got a good eight hours of sleep and I woke up and it was midnight and I had another 10 hours before the sun came up. So I was just laying there in the dark, looking up at the sky and I saw this big meteorite shoot across and break up and 30 seconds later I actually heard the explosion of the meteor breaking up in the atmosphere. I heard the shooting star.

That's incredible. Holy cow. And what about people? Were you ever camping with people much or was that purely on your own?

You know, I did have people join me at different times in the trip. I was out for a thousand days, about 160, I had other people join me. I had a girlfriend join me at the start for two months, a different girlfriend joined me in the middle for a couple of weeks. It was a long trip, you know.

Hang on,

how'd you get different girlfriends on a big trip like that?

Well, the first one, the first one started with me and, she broke up with me while I was out there. She was married to someone else before I finished my bike ride is how long I was out there for. wow. and you know, and then I met someone else, my dad joined me in New Zealand for a month and, then people off and on found, found me along the way.

okay, fair enough. Yeah.

Yeah, New Zealand's a bit of a dream. I've obviously road tripped it quite a few times, but biking it would be pretty cool as well.

Great. went to it. It looked like Lord of the Rings. We're going to those areas and it's like, this is what the movie looks like.

And when you were meeting like random people, did you like explain or like, I guess, exchange trips or exchange like tips and maybe places to go? Is that how that works?

Yeah. When I met other cyclists out there, um, honestly, we'd always talk about the Hills with the head. We obsess about that. Um, and yeah, you know, if, if we had time, we would sit by the side of the road and talk for an hour. Like we didn't, weren't going, we didn't, weren't trying to get anywhere that night. It was always nice to meet other cyclists out there. And, you know, especially like the Alaska to Argentina route, a lot of people do that.

Yeah

And there's bottlenecks where there's, there's kind of just one way to go. Um, so he ended up bumping into some of the same people again and again, as they're also doing their year long trip, you know, it's just fun. It's, it was so rare to see someone even twice out there that I was always excited to bump into someone a second time.

And in those times, how did you keep in contact with them or was that just purely by chance again? Wow. That's pretty, it's pretty melancholy when you think about it. If it happens, it happens. Right. Yeah.

Just be by chance. Yeah.

That's how it was. mean, the friendships would last until they were out of sight, you know, and that's just how it was.

How did you record each day of your trip?

I type my journal into my tablet and lay in my hammock and write each night. And I would email that to when I got to wifi, it would go out to my closest friends. And that's kind of how I kept from being lonely. was just, I was just monologuing at my friends in my head. And that was enough to not feel alone.

Yeah, yeah, because I guess I know we talk about people joining you, but it must have a lot of days, like you said, you just didn't see anyone. Or weeks.

You know, I get pretty remote, but I was on road, so there's always people around. and in the most remote places, people would always stop to make sure I was okay. Cause there's not nothing out there. and in total in the whole trip, maybe there was five days where I did not talk to anyone at all. I didn't buy anything. So no one to say hello to anyone at the grocery store or meet anyone out there. So it would happen, but it was pretty rare.

It was a unique day where I didn't talk to anyone.

you

Hey yeah, just a quick one. I just want to say there are many ways to support this podcast. You can buy me a coffee and help support the podcast with $5. Or you can go to my merch store with the affiliate link with T-Public where there's plenty of merch available to buy such as t-shirts, jumpers, hoodies, and also some children's clothing. Thirdly, which is free, you can also rate and review this podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Podchaser, or Goodpods. Also, you can find me on social media on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook.

and TikTok. Simply just search for Winging It Travel Podcast and you'll find me displaying all my social media content for traveling, podcast and other stuff. Thank you. Okay. And you mentioned earlier about people helping you out. I've got a question about food because I've interviewed a few bikers who say after a few weeks, they just constantly eat because they use so many calories. Were you eating more or were you quite strict on that or was it always the same? And also if you went

I don't know, if you knew you'd be five days away in nature, did you plan for that ahead of time to make sure you had enough food on you?

Yeah. Um,

at the start, I would make sure I just had enough to get to the next store. Now that I went further, I started just bringing a few extra days of food with me in case I wanted to, you know, stop early one day or sometimes I would meet people and we'd share a meal and then I would be down a meal. So it's nice just to have a little extra. And, um, I would basically, I would always just shop at grocery stores, eating out of restaurants, more of a chance of getting food poisoning or something. I didn't want to risk it. So.

Really, just, it was just like a lot of bread and cheese. you know, change region to region from what the stores had in the poor countries. The food quality was really bad. And in the wealthier countries, you could get different sorts of stuff. and each night I would, I'd have my, I'd have my cooking pot and make my rice or my noodles and put a can of beans in and some cheese. And I swear for.

hundreds of days in a row, I would make one spoonful too much and it would be spilling. And it's because I just needed to eat it, make as big a meal as I possibly could. And man, I would just always make just slightly too much.

Was there any foods you got sick of? Because you kept eating them all the time?

no, I was, I was amazed that I just love to eat noodles and cheese again and again.

And did you have any like breakfast rules like was it like nice avocado, banana or something or just whatever you had?

Yeah, I mean, if there's fruit around, definitely get some fruit. I tried to eat healthy out there because when I started, I ate a lot of Nutella and stuff like that. But that would have been fine if I was out there for two months or something, but to be out there for years, just eating junk food. Suddenly it felt like too much. So I would, you know, I would cook and try to eat pretty healthy. And actually at, at night after I finished eating, I would take my cooking pot and I'd find an anthill.

Yeah.

And I'd set it down next to an ant hill and I would let the ants clean my dishes. I did, I did this literally every night. It's all over the world. If it was a big, if it was a big ant hill and big ants, would do a great job clean everything. There's little ants, maybe they wouldn't get to it all, but I was eating the same meal the next day. So I didn't bother with cleaning it myself.

That's crazy. Any foods that you missed on the trek?

you know, I'm not a big foodie. So, you know, it really wasn't a big priority for me to be trying a lot of different foods while I was out there or missing foods for back home.

Okay, and what about water? I know you said you bought some and carry some. Did you have one of those like filter water bottles where you can just pick up any water and filter it out?

I have filters as well. Um, I'd pump from streams or, know, it would have to be high on a hill. I didn't want any houses above me if I was filtering water. Uh, but also if I was high on the hill and there's no houses above me, I would also just drink out of the, I also wouldn't filter it. Yeah. There was one day I was biking and just some water is coming down on, um, kind of on the berm on the side of the road and a little mossy and.

There is, there is nothing up above just kind of some trees and stuff. So just showed my water kind of on the side of the road there. I ended up getting some algae growing in the bottom of my water bottle, but my hand was too big to get in there to clean it. So I ended up having algae growing in my water bottle for the next year. And, you know, I didn't, I didn't take that. Sometimes it flake off a little bit, but sometimes it would freak my water bottles would freeze and it would come back to life afterwards. was, it was my little.

That's my little pet.

some reason I'm not surprised at that. Yeah. Okay. I've got some like, like quick fire questions here, like some of your favorite or best type of stuff. So I got here, which three countries were best for roads.

Best for roads, you know, United States has good roads. It's nice shores, Canada as well. And where else would have been nice? You know, there was, there was really, those are like nice, well-paid roads. Roads are getting far out. like down in Peru, I was just following these little dirt paths way up into the mountains. And that was totally fun in its own way.

So remote. Okay. And what about for helping you out? You mentioned people that do help you out. Was any country that was specifically good at that?

You know, all down through, um, the all through central America, uh, people gave me more every day. People are giving me food and helping me out. Uh, you know, I would just tell people what I was doing. And it just, it was just sounded so hard. couldn't help, but want to assist in some way. Man, I got a, I got tons of free bananas down there.

Bonus, okay. I'm going to flip the road question around. Any countries that are really bad for roads that you experienced?

you know, in, Honduras, I, I bicycling onto roads that they would Peter out and just turn into grass field. That's how few people were using them. but at least I knew where they went where like Mongolia, those were the most, those are the most remote roads. And, and in Mongolia, nothing's growing in the section that I was biking through. It's, it's kind of open desert, totally open desert.

to get directions, people, they would just point to a mountain that you could see 20 miles away. And they would just say, go to the left of that and keep going. Like those are the sorts of directions and wherever someone needed to go, they, didn't have to follow the road. They would just turn their car that way and go. so, you know, it hard to, it's hard. was just kind of navigating by compass, following dirt tracks that just kind of shot off and every which strip, which way.

At each, at each Y in the road, would pause and I would just take a long look and try to decide which one got more traffic. And then I would follow that way. And, and, and the roads there, they would get washboarded, really, really bumpy. And so it's annoying for me on my bike, but in cars as well. So the cars would just move over one, you know, one car width and start a new path and in places where the ground got

bumpy like that easily, there might be 80 or a hundred car car lanes where people just kept shifting over one more vehicle with, until it was a huge hundred lane highway going through the desert of people trying to avoid the bump.

Do think Mongolia was the most desolate place you went to?

It was the most far out I got for sure. So I biked down through the Gobi desert, which, but then, mean, I, I didn't plan anything. I just kind of found myself there. And, yeah, it was hard to, it was hard to survive out there. So not many people are living out there.

Yeah, cause I think out of all the countries on that list that you mentioned earlier, I just think Mongolia, think it's literally, well, I think it's literally going to be just a desolate country for miles and miles and days because it's notoriously known as quite being that anyway, if you travel by car, right? So if you're biking, is a different level.

It was, you know, it was hard out there. Um, and you know, like my Mongolia story is, um, I was there maybe three weeks and I was, I was excited to get to China where the roads had become paved again. I could get some food and, and, know, I was excited to get back to civilization. And so I arrived at the border and there are three border crossings in Mongolia and I arrived at the central one and I'm informed there because I didn't.

Research this. said, this is only for Mongolian Chinese citizens. You have to go to the next border over. And he's like, he just, he just points into the desert. And he said, it's about 400 miles that way. And, that was a real low point for me. You asked if I ever felt like quitting that would have been a moment, but no one's coming for me. Like it's not easy to quit when you're out on a trip.

You've got to get yourself to a place where you can quit. And by that point, you might as well just keep going. So I turned into the desert and I just started pedaling.

That's a great point actually. You can't just quit. People are thinking, you quit whenever, any day, but actually logistically, you actually can't just quit. that's one of those moments, right? Well, I can think about quitting, but it's 400 miles that way, so I've got to go.

Yeah,

exactly. When I did quit in the very end, it took me another 50 days to get home.

Yeah, come to that. I've got a couple of questions about that later actually. What three countries, I know you weren't spending much anyway, but what are the best for budget? Well, uh... And the most expensive as well, if you want to chuck that in there.

Switzerland was the most expensive for sure. And you know, a lot of countries are actually very cheap, uh, relative to United States. China had a, you know, you could get a big, nice big meal for a dollar 50. So I ended up cooking my cooking less in China just because the food was so cheap and good over there. Yeah. Uh, down in, South America, uh, I get a nice three star hotel room for $10. A lot of places it was.

quite inexpensive to be basically homeless as I was traveling around.

Okay, and any scary experiences or any close encounters with maybe a bike been stolen or anything like that?

You know, I didn't have any, don't try to steal from me, but, I had this experience in Honduras. was camping. had my hammock up on a hillside and I got in there at dusk. No one saw me sneak in there, but just after dark, someone was walking home from work and they, and they saw me. And I said, hello, you know, in my best Spanish, which was not very good at the time. Said I'll be, you know, dormir aqui. I'll be sleeping here.

And, uh, he just kind of nodded and walked off and, and maybe an hour later I was, you know, falling asleep in my hammock and I, some people are down below, below me on the hill. And I got up to go see who it was and five guys came up the hill. had ski masks on and they all had gun. I was scared, but it turns out they were the neighborhood watch and they were just explaining, you know,

C-

We had to see who you were because we're worried about ourselves. And, they lectured me. They said, don't just go be sneaking into people's neighborhoods. And, and then they said, like, if you get back on the road now, it's dangerous. So just stay here for the night and we'll look out for you. I didn't, I moved a little bit, they didn't know where I was, but, you know, it was scary, but they were, they were also scared and, no one meant anyone harm.

Wow.

Okay. That brings me to the next question. Actually, I'd spin to El Salvador last year. I went there for two weeks because now it's pretty safe. But back in those days, did you track through El Salvador? And if so, was that pretty scary?

I didn't go through El Salvador. went through a Sula San Pedro in Honduras, which is the murder capital of the world. well, you know, I stayed on the outskirts and no, no gang members saw me. So, you know, I, I was on, I'm, mostly avoided any cities. think a lot of that sort of crime happens in cities. So I was like in, in rural farm communities, where I think it's just safer because.

Yeah.

There's no money for a gang to make out in a rural community. They stay in the cities.

Sure, yeah. What about the daring gap? How do you navigate that?

I took a ferry around that from Panama to Cartagena, Colombia.

No more room. Okay. Fair enough. is there any awesome experiences that stood out? Maybe a couple that you just think that was a great experience could be with people or seeing a bit of nature or even a meal. Like was anything that stands out?

Yeah, that's sick. Um, you know, the highlights for me, going down to the Andes in South America, we're just really, um, just beautiful, fantastic places to be. And, um, I remember bicycling around Lake Titicaca was, and it's the elevation at Lake is, uh, I don't remember exactly, but it's like 13,000 feet. It's way up in the way up high. I biked around that Lake and.

Nice image.

On my map, I saw this little whiny road headed up a mountain. And I had this idea of trying to find the highest road in the whole world to bicycle up. And I find the exact one, but this road took me all the way up to 17,100 feet. And it had a view looking down out over La Paz, the capital down there. And just laying down up there in the cold beneath the bright stars.

That was, you know, like one of the summits of my trip, you know, and that was as high as I ever got. And there was a few experiences like that, like just moments that were the maximum of the whole trip.

Yeah. Okay. And how did you keep in contact with home? You might mention that before, but that's through your iPad and whenever you got wifi, but how, how accessible in those days was wifi?

You know, I would find it maybe once a week. Okay. and then in Africa, last I was going to or more weeks between fine and wifi.

Mmm, yeah, okay. And did you ever go home in between any of these days or was it purely on the road for 999 days?

I did manage to go home from South America. went back and got my dad to join me in New Zealand. I over there together. Um, and then between China and Alaska, I went back home and I, you know, I had to reconfigure my bike and wait a little bit for the weather to change. So I wanted to be a ship at sea, but my, bike just every, every single thing except the frame got replaced.

Okay.

Okay, yeah

over time. So I was wearing stuff out. needed to go home and get some good parts.

Was there any occasion where your bike punctured a tyre in the middle of nowhere? Was there any those situations where the bike just broke?

Yeah, it happened twice. my rear hub, the, the bearings would break because it was loaded. And the first time it happened, is about 11,000 miles. I was in China when the thing just disintegrated. I managed to make my way to a bike shop. the second time it happened, I was in, I was on the island of Tasmania, South of Australia. And it was literally the most remote remote place I had ever been when my

Hmm.

Are ya?

pedal fell off and All I could all I could do was push and the next the next town was 90 kilometers away But you know, I had a few days of food and I'm just out there anyway, so I just started pushing it really didn't make any difference to me and I put for 25 hours before the first car came by and They picked me up

I'd hope so. You mentioned China and Russia before. Language. Did you learn or had to learn local languages in places like that? Because I'd imagine English is not spoken that much.

No, I learned Spanish when I hit the Mexican border going south. It was about a year in Spanish speaking countries. These other countries, I just learned to speak with my hands and Russia was pretty early on. Both those countries were fairly early on in my trip, but what I learned over time is everyone asked me the exact same questions. Where are you going? Where are you coming from? How long have you been out? Are you married? It was pretty common.

And so when I meet people and either I could start to understand the question specifically, or I would just assume that's what they were asking. And I could answer those questions. I would point, point ahead of me and say the next city or country. I would point behind me and say Portugal. And, you know, so I would just learn to communicate, just as simple answers that covered most of my conversations.

Okay, and any visa problems? Like did you run out time in any countries?

no, I never did have any visa issues, fortunately.

That's good. Because I can imagine you would be in a country where you have, I don't know, 60 days on your tourist visa and you've reached, I don't know, 50 and you're nowhere near the border. That'd be quite stressful, wouldn't it?

Well, in Mongolia, I had 30 days and I was, I would kind of race into cross the country before I ran out of time. because I went to the wrong border crossing, I ended up late, but they didn't, they didn't even care.

Okay, fair enough. And we're going to talk about the end of the journey. How did you know you're maybe starting to come towards the end?

So

the first, when I knew I getting close was the first day that I woke up and didn't feel like riding my bike anywhere. It was, was the first day that I, um, just took a zero day, no miles and wasn't in a town. I just out camping and, I knew, knew it taken it had taken 940 days, but I finally woke up and didn't want to go ride my bike.

Where was that?

It was in Africa. It was out in Africa. that's when I was getting close.

How did that manifest to actually ending your trip? Was there a few days where you tried to let it pass and get back on the horse if you like? Or how did that work?

Yep.

Yeah, basically I was just trying to continue on and, I just, have a clear, clear memory of just sitting and having lunch on the edge of a farm field and just having this, it's like, hang, running through my body of the idea. I think I'm done. And I just ignored it. You know, I'd been out a long time and I didn't want to, I didn't want to believe it, but

It's, you know, it wasn't going away a few days later. I felt it again. And, uh, it wasn't long after that before. If I could have teleported home, I would have, I was at my wits end.

And how did that logistically work then? Because obviously at that point you've decided that's it. But obviously like you mentioned a minute ago, you can't just quit. You know, there's got to be a plan to quit because you might be in the middle of nowhere or you might be quite far from a board or whatever. So how did that actually work logistically? Because you decided to quit. So how long was that journey to actually quit and then get back?

Yeah. So when I decided to be done, I wasn't really close to anything, but there was a town a couple of days ahead and I could have caught a bus from there to the airport. And that was my plan. But it was two days away and it was two days after I quit. By the time I got to the town and trying to figure out the bus and I, it's just easier to bicycle than to catch the bus. So I left town like into another

two weeks without internet, two weeks of not wanting to be out there basically. was really beautiful terrain. I'm glad I kept going, but it was hard. Eventually, I just made my way to an airport. I just biked to an airport. Then from there, from Africa, I actually flew to Europe again. Towards the end, it gets strange. What does motivate someone to keep going after they've gone?

950 days. So I go 951. And if there was a reason, I would have come to hate that reason for making me go that long. You know, that's why I was always careful never to do this for charity because I would, I would curse that charity by the end. But so for me, what was the motivation? Um, each night on my tablet, I would drop a pin of where I was camping that night and

Yeah.

slowly over time I was drawing this line gracefully around the entire world. And that line became important. When I got to one coast, I'd fly to the next closest coast and continue and it had to be complete and take me all the way back home. And that's the reason I was going another day, just to continue that line. And so when I finally did quit and was flying out of Africa,

I still can't let myself just fly all the way back to the United States. I I flew to Europe because that was the next closest coast. had to, I had to stop and I biked like another two weeks in Europe and I. I biked to, I biked into France and crossed the border in the France and it was raining. had my rain, red, red raincoat and my black rain pants. And I had a picture from three years earlier, the first time I biked in the.

France with the same red raincoat and the same pants because it was raining then. And I'm just like, I got to go home. I'm repeating myself. Like that's, it's gotta be done.

Is it easier or harder to bike after you decided to quit?

Well,

it was, it was hard. It was hard to get like going, just having to be patient. And honestly, it was hard kind of the emotional arc of the trip. I was on my way out all the way to the Southern tip of South America, which might've been about, maybe 750 days going. That was, that was my summit. That was on the way out was.

Yeah, patience, yeah.

the fire and excitement and invigorated. And from that point on the tip of South America, I wanted to take myself home. Soldiers used to walk home from the war explorers. They'd sail to the other side of the earth and they'd have to go home at the pace of the wind. You can't, you can't rush it. And I didn't want to take that return journey away from it myself. wanted to experience that part of exploration as well. And so.

From that point onwards, New Zealand, Australia, Africa, that all felt like the return journey. And emotionally it was, it was much different because I felt just going to I quit, but in a way I had a destination. I was counting down until I made it all the way back to Colorado. and it became torturous in a way when I was on the way out and I only had to think about making it to tomorrow. I could do that.

Hmm.

Yeah. For years, right? But on the way back, it would, that's not how it felt, you know, it was a countdown and it became too hard and they get it got to me.

Yeah, because it's a complete different switch of mentality. Almost totally overnight, I'd imagine.

Yeah. Yeah. And, and like, as I'm explaining it, I recognize what was going on in the moment as well. So it was clear to me how, why I was feeling that way.

And what were your initial feelings going back home? Because I've actually talked on the podcast a few times about this, where it could be just a big trip, six months a year. could be biking, could be just traveling, whatever. There's always that weird feeling when you come back home. Cause you don't know how to explain the trip. How can you even explain it when they've not even been in one day of your shoes, right? So how did you deal with those sort of feelings?

I did feel very isolated in the experience. and I thought I'd become unrelatable because, I was out there, I was really just by myself for years and no human mirrors to reflect anything that I was doing. in that environment, I could get some strange ideas and just.

go with it because there's no one around to tell me otherwise. I just felt like I had become strange out there. How do I explain it? I heard an astronaut explaining he went to space and looked down, saw no borders, all of humanity right in front of him and it moved him. He came home and

You try to explain it, without going to space, people couldn't get it. And I said, yeah, but at least you had other astronauts to talk about with it. didn't have anyone. And so, I felt hugely inspired at the time I had survived that journey. was, I felt like I was floating. was a beautiful time in my life right after I got back from that trip. And how do I explain it? that's why I started the podcast.

Yeah

That's why I'm doing a day by day retelling. have the journal. I want to bring people to that moment I quit. And for them to get it, I want to bring them every step of the way.

I guess that's the only way you can do it. I guess because you do have that journal, which is, do you not think, at least you have the journal because I didn't journal for my first ever six months traveling or whatever, or even have a camera, right? So I had no real recollection apart from photos from my friend and maybe the odd Facebook update. But at least you have the journal to go back on because that's bit of gold dust right there, isn't it?

I love reading back to the journal and I'm surprised how well I remember everything. But if I didn't have the journal to remind me, I wouldn't remember any of it. And the journal, if I didn't have the journal, I would write a short book. Since I have the journal, I'm doing a thousand day retelling of this epic journey. So it's, yeah, it's totally changed how I'm able to integrate the experience just cause I have all that information.

And what were some of valuable lessons you learnt from your trip that you took into real life afterwards? Not real life, but like, I guess, I don't know how to describe it, normal life in brackets.

you know, one of the strange ideas I got out there was that there is a perfect way to do everything, especially like with an engineering background. I feel like there's a perfect design for everything. Right. And it is, it's elusive and honestly, you to try all this stuff that doesn't work to know that there's a best one. But I would, I would, I would experience that I would roll up my hammock each night or each morning and I would try to do it perfectly. And I remember.

in Africa, so very late in the trip, I finally got it. The perfect, perfect Hanukkah roll. And I took a photo and I was so proud. And, and so when I got back, was, I was throwing that mindset of, working really hard and being very focused and clear about doing things perfectly, creating something that's perfect.

And did you have any like reflections on your trip that caused you some trouble in back in normal life afterwards?

Well, it's still emotional. Having done that, the emotions are still big enough to bring me to tears sometimes. Well, maybe a more visceral explanation. My roommates had got a dog and while I was traveling, I was chased by dogs all over the world.

Okay, yeah.

I imagine, yeah.

I had gotten a real contentious relationship with dogs. And when he, when he brought that dog home, it was, really affected me. hadn't realized just how scared of them I had become. so, you know, that's something I've gotten over to some extent, you know, it affected me when I got.

Yeah.

home.

Yeah, that's fair enough. Okay. And before we go to your podcast, I've got one question. you, what's your reflection on 999 days? I can imagine there's some OCD people like really kicking off right now. Why it's not a thousand. I don't care. I think it's quite cool, but is there any thoughts on that or is it just a number?

I had stopped counting long before I finished. So I was done and I'm like, well, how long was it? And I came up with 999. But so if I had known to go one more day just for the sake of counting after having traveled 999 days, it would have been insanity. It would have just been the craziest thing in the world just to go one more day, just to count it. That's how I feel about it.

fair enough because it is arbitrary in the end isn't it? Just a number.

Yeah. And that's not what was motivating me. you know, honestly, I think about it. If I had gone 200 days, I probably still could have been talking to you on this podcast. Impressive. so that, that next 800 days was just some sort of cruel joke I was playing on myself. Like, like it meant nothing to anybody else.

Of course.

Yeah, yeah.

because they were already impressed. It was only just for me. So to go one more day just to tell someone else I did a thousand instead of 999, it really, it's so silly.

Yeah, it's like, I don't know, having $10 million, I think once you get to that point, another 10 million doesn't make a difference, it? It's like that sort of idea.

Certainly 10 million, 1,000,000 doesn't make a difference.

Fair enough. Okay. And you mentioned your podcast, it's called How to Move to Star. Tell the listeners, you probably just explained it already, just where they can find that and what your premise is for that podcast and maybe some ideas about how often is it released? Is it every day? How do you plan to do that podcast?

Yeah, it's called how to move the stars. You can find it on how to move the stars.com. The name comes from when I was in Alaska, the North star was high above me. And as I traveled South, I watched that North star drop to their eyes in, and then the Southern Cross started coming up. Just, just with the power in my legs, I have moving the stars in the sky. So that's how to move the stars. And it's, it's a day by day retelling each episode is about two minutes or less. They're short. come out twice a week.

Crazy.

And so it's going to come out over the next 10 years. People are going to slowly come on this journey with me all around the world.

And is that on video or just audio?

It's both. It works just great as just audio, but on YouTube there's also a Google, it's a Google flyover of my route that I did. So you can see the mountain terrain of the day as well as the photographs of the day that I took flashing up as well.

Okay, and where can people follow you and that podcast on social media or websites?

Yeah, you can find everything at howtomovethestars.com. That'll direct them everywhere they need to go.

Okay, and finally, any travel plans for this year?

This year, let's see, you know, my, wife is getting her PhD and she's going to be in Guatemala doing research for the summer. So I'm sure I'll get down there to visit her at some point.

amazing. Yeah, just came back from there in November. That's great. OK, and we're going to finish with some quick fire travel questions. So these are going to be some of your favorite things to finish the episode. This can be from your trip you mentioned or previous travels or travels since then. Right. So anything you want. So I'm going to kick off with and they're going to be arbitrary, so you might not like them, but let's do it anyway.

It's travel question time. Give me top three favorite countries that you love to travel to.

Peru, Costa Rica, and I'd say Mongolia. felt it was so far out over there. I would definitely go back.

Nice. And what about three countries you've not traveled to that would be next on your hit list?

that I would, let's see that, you know, trying to think, I want to go everywhere. Where would I not want to go? You know, I wouldn't go back to Spain. was so much rain in Spain that I, I don't think I'll ever go back there. Ukraine, I buy to Ukraine. I mean, they're in a war right now, so I like to, never end up back there. Okay. and then, I started one.

You know, Australia, Australia was fun, but it was so much like the United States that, I'd recommend bike touring somewhere else.

Fair enough. What about three new countries?

Great new countries. man, I would love to explore Africa some more. Egypt. you know, some of the, the Ivory coast, some of those really well put together, wealthy African countries. I've heard it's just great touring over there. Also like, Greece and Iran I heard is great for bike touring. I like to go to those places as well.

Yeah, I I interviewed someone who was biking across Iran. They loved it. Yeah. They couch surfed. So free if you like, but yeah, the locals are very welcoming and definitely help you out and give you a bit of an experience. So yeah, that'd be pretty cool. I think it's just a nightmare with a visa situation, isn't it? Unfortunately. Yeah. Okay. What about top three favorite cuisines or foods they've had?

I'm sure, yeah.

You know,

let's see the paputas down in Columbia, street tacos in Mexico and then meat pies in New Zealand. You said you're down there. Did you get a bunch of meat pies down there? I lived off of those things.

yeah, % yeah.

I used to live there, yeah, had plenty of those. Which comes to the next question. If you could live anywhere in the world for one year, where would you live? It can't be your own country.

Maybe Japan. I think it's accessible, but also just a very different culture than the US. think it would just be fascinating.

Yeah, 100%. Okay. Are you a sunrise or sunset person?

I aspire to be a sunrise person, I catch way more sunsets.

Okay, and do have a favorite mountain or mountain range? I'll give you the option of that as well.

yeah, I've, I just got to say the, the Andes. just love being down in those Andes. there were so many mountains that were a mile or more prominent. They were just so big that, I would love to go spend more time there.

Okay, and to finish the episode, if someone is listening right now and is maybe a bit nervous about doing this type of trip or just travel in general, what could you say to them in a few sentences to inspire them to go? Well...

Just do what feels comfortable and you'll probably impress yourself.

Okay.

Jacob, thanks for the chat. It's been an awesome journey for summarizing your trip. And I think people just need to check out your podcast to get the real details of each day because I can imagine that would be pretty cool. So thanks for coming on to my podcast to talk about it and giving us a sense of your trip and your travels as well. Thanks so much. Cheers dude. Appreciate it. Thanks for tuning into the podcast episode today. If you've been inspired by today's chat and want to book some travel,

Absolutely. Thanks for having me.

If you head to the show notes, you'll see some affiliate links below which helps support this podcast. You'll find Skyscanner to book your flight. You'll find Booking.com to book that accommodation. Want to stay in a super cool hostel? You'll see Hostel World down there too. You'll find Revolut to get your travel card sorted. Click the GIGSky link to get your eSIM ready for your trip. And more importantly, you'll find Safety Wing Insurance to get that travel insurance for your trip. There are many more to check out, so when you click that link and book your product, a small commission goes towards me.

and the Wigginit Travel Podcast. Thank you in advance and enjoy your travels.